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Model 1917 M.G. Cart in a Crate unboxing.

6K views 14 replies 11 participants last post by  redroth 
#1 · (Edited)
Most guys have read the threads on the Carts in a crate. I purchased a M.G. Cart #353003 from Len around Aug 2013. I arranged for it to be picked up by Mike Pop in Sept. He brought it back to his house in Nevada and it sat there until July 2014. He was going to Mogfest in Sheridan Oregon and I picked it up than. Well actually its over 500 lbs so we slide it from trailer to trailer. I was going on a big vacation in Aug so I didnt want to touch it. A few weeks ago I started unboxing it and took a photo on all four sides every time I took a part out of the crate.

The crate has some rot/damage and a couple of missing boards. My plane is to identify what type of wood it is (Appears to be two different species) and hopefully purchase some vintage boards from one of the many business that do that sort of thing. Might be easier than trying to age my own stuff. Im still unsure if I will put the Cart back in the crate or display it next to it. These crates seem to be more of what I would call a transportation crate than a long term/storage crate. The parts were just basically laying in there without the usual pieces of wood or anything to keep the parts from shifting. So storing it the crate and trying to bring this to a show or two might be difficult if the parts keep shifting around. At this point Im also only going to clean the Cart with mild soap and water and leave it as found. I dont think rat crap qualifies as patina so Im going to clean it.

Have been overwhelmed lately with pretty much everything so Its going at a snails pace. Im going to put the Cart together and have it upstairs in my Dads barn for the time being so I can drool over it for now.

So if I have my towns/states figured out correctly these were found and purchased from Paul in North Mississippi......Picked up by Robert (CNKillerclown) and transported to Memphis Tn. June 2013......Picked up by Len L999here and transported to Walkerton In......Picked up by Mike Pop and transported to nevada Sept 2013 where it sat until I picked it up at Mogfest Sheridan Or.July 2014 and brought it home to Bonney Lake Wash. If Im lucky to have time and money it will make another long trip to the MVPA Convention August 11-13, 2016 at the Alameda County Fairgrounds in Pleasanton, CA

Len..The tool box is sitting in my garage right now.

More photos here. Cant guarantee they uploaded in the right order. Need to check and arrange them.
http://handcartz.smugmug.com/HAND-C...53003/43767028_TbWHWC#!i=3475455131&k=BJgDwrL

A couple of threads about the Cart from the 1919A4 forums.
http://1919a4.com/showthread.php?46...n-Carts-Really&highlight=model+1917+ammo+cart

http://1919a4.com/showthread.php?38296-model-1917-ammunition-cart&highlight=model+1917+ammo+cart



Thank you to everyone involved who helped these Carts survive.

CNKillerclown photo.



Cart on the way home. Stopped by and visited my friend Rick Larson in Oregon who is a founding father of Cart collecting. I know he was scrounging Cart parts at Smith & Edwards in the 70s.



Big thanks to my Dad who has went on almost every long road trip.





















Axle pins and washers. Vickers M.G. Tripod bracket. Only know about the bracket thanks to Gatekeeper and her drawings she posted.







Patina/Rat crap





I assembled the Cart today. Still doesnt have all the bolts and most of the pins will not go through the holes. Will have to work on that in the future.







 
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#4 ·
Amazing that something survived for nearly 100 years still in its shipping crate.
 
#8 ·
...finally....!!!

Well done,Craig..!!! I did the same thing...took pic's of every part as each was taken out of the crate. Your thoughts about just cleaning the cart up and placing it beside the empty crate for display is the best idea I've heard. However,since the 3rd. cart...another ammo cart...was already taken out of the crate and in pieces,I cleaned it,painted it and restored it to original condition after I had to make the tool boxes and ammo-carrier. Everything else was original equipment. The only other things I had to add were the lynch pins and spacer washers you have shown in the tool box on the gun cart.

I'm now thinking of doing this to the crated ammo cart,as you have proposed,to just clean-up,paint to original just-left-the-factory condition and display it next to the original crate. This sounds much easier and more historically correct. That way the cart could be displayed and folks would be able to see the original factory crate. And it would be easier to transport. I have now taken 3-carts...Gun cart,ammo cart,spare gun cart.... to IN State MVPA meets every year since 2012 and then to the National MVPA this June. I also have had 3-carts at a military museum for a WW1 display since April this year and posted pic's on an earlier thread.

As soon as Jodie gets back to RIA from her TDY,I hope to be able to obtain many more drawings of the 1917 carts and learn much more about them. So far,I've been able to determine that the carts were made by only 1-mfg....International Harvester,at the MacCormic works in Chicago,IL...from April,1917 to May 1933. That's the latest date on some of the drawings I've obtained from Jodie.
 
#10 · (Edited)
...easy does it...

Most of the holes are packed with dirt,crap,crud and such...after over 80+ yrs of sitting in a barn. Get a 3/8th drill bit and just drill them out,as most of the holes are 3/8th. Just started wiping down my ammo cart-in-the-crate with an oily rag and found that the ammo carrier top pieces are marked 'VICKERS' in black paint. This is cart #300646 and I had assumed that by this time all the carts would be configured for the 1917 Browning. However,the Vickers and Browning used the same size wood ammo box's,so I guess they just left them as-is. Will have some pic's showing this later. Craig's cart is #353005 and I'm wondering if the ammo carrier top pieces are also marked this way....?
 

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#13 ·
I forgot to look last night ,but since you brought it up I blew up one of the pictures and it does say Vickers on the ammo box holder/carrier. "Good" might be easier to find a Vickers Tripod and parts kit, "Bad" dont own any Vickers Ammo boxes. Have to start watching for them.

I was considering selling these. Glad I never did.

 
#14 ·
...tools and loader...?

Would have to go do a search thru the threads....but isn't the grey/blue striped box for a 1928 Colt Belt Loader...? Believe the red striped box is for the tools for the 1928 Colt. Between the wars,the military was so stripped of men and equipment that they used whatever they could scrounge for equipping the carts and their other stuff. Too bad the Europeans have all the stuff we left behind after 2-wars over there. I remember seeing a pic of a pile of gun carts in Paris over 2-stories tall....sometime between the wars...being burned up. This was just after I started collecting the carts. Realized then why the 1917 cart series is so rare over here
 
#15 ·
Would have to go do a search thru the threads....but isn't the grey/blue striped box for a 1928 Colt Belt Loader...? Believe the red striped box is for the tools for the 1928 Colt. Between the wars,the military was so stripped of men and equipment that they used whatever they could scrounge for equipping the carts and their other stuff. Too bad the Europeans have all the stuff we left behind after 2-wars over there. I remember seeing a pic of a pile of gun carts in Paris over 2-stories tall....sometime between the wars...being burned up. This was just after I started collecting the carts. Realized then why the 1917 cart series is so rare over here
The red striped box is for the 1915 Vickers (US) belt loader, the other box with the light blue stripe is for the 1915 Colt (US) parts kit. These both look like they are missing their partitions (common). I have these box also and can probably dig them out pretty easily and photograph if need be. I also have the belt loader but am missing some of the parts for it (handle, feed hopper, etc.). The ammo boxes (lid on the top though) are the same size and are commonly available of eBay for $50 - $100 each depending on condition.

The hard one to find is the matching water can which is quite unique. I know someone on the forum has a picture of it.

L999here is correct in the fact that other Countries/Weapons manufacturers also used the same color coding on their belt loader, parts, and tool boxes as they were often the same sizes so the crew could tell the boxes apart without opening them.
 
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